Options for ASL on the YSF DR-1X and DR-2X repeaters.

Custom Products for the Analog Radio Amateur Enthusiast

Options for ASL on the YSF DR-1X and DR-2X repeaters.
Understanding all of the available options and limitations.

Detailed Explanation:
I'm glad you're reaching out for assistance prior to simply ordering something and hoping it would do what you want. Because of limitations imposed by some Yaesu System Fusion repeaters - there is no 'one size fits all' answer. And, as such - there are actually several options to put AllStar Link on a Yaesu DR-1X or DR-2X. The option chosen depends on what all features and capabilities are desired. So - it's probably best to understand all of the options so you can make an informed decision.

Understanding the options requires explaining the "problems" and the different options as to why each one might be considered. To complicate the situation - some functionality of the YSF repeater is dictated by the firmware running on it. Therefore - there are some unknowns. One of these is the ability to decode and encode a CTCSS tone while the repeater is set to the remote mode. Thankfully - there are hardware options to resolve everything - - no matter what firmware is running on the repeater. Obviously that adds cost to the project, but you can choose what features you want / need and choose the option that works for you. You'll need to perform some simple tests on your repeater to know what it does (and doesn't do). This will (also) dictate which option you may want to consider.

I'll apologize now - this is long, but everything is important, so please read it completely. For these Yaesu System Fusion repeaters and your situation - there isn't an easy answer.

I'll first explain the 'problems' that some people encounter.

Poor FM noise squelch detection:
The FM (noise) squelch detection / action on a Yaesu System Fusion repeater can be problematic for seasoned operators. The YSF repeater's internal squelch circuitry determines when to mute / unmute the FM receive audio based on a RSSI level system -- not on an amount of quieting. RSSI means "received signal strength indication". Even with the squelch set to a 'critical' position, the mediocre squelch operation results in a mobile or moving portable user being 'chopped out' by the squelch action while still having enough quieting to be understood. If you've encountered this with your repeater and want to fix it - there's a hardware solution. If you or your users haven't noticed the squelch clipping / cutting people off that drop into the noise, then there's no need for a better noise squelch detection system. A COS signal at pin 4 of the 15 pin (HD-15) accessory connector is available for connection to the radio interface.

If you've experienced this problem and hate it, a better noise squelch circuit can be added externally to the repeater. There are actually several different squelch solutions to choose from. My MS-25 or MS-50 provides superior noise squelch detection and a buffered logic signal. However - these are not the only available options depending on some other things you need to consider. That's especially true of what's mentioned next.

Available CTCSS detection:
Whether or not you need a hardware solution to provide a reliable CTCSS logic signal depends on if you need/want CTCSS access, and, if the repeater actually provides a CTCSS detect logic signal when the repeater is operating in remote mode. Depending on the model and version of software, decoding and encoding a CTCSS tone with internal hardware may work, or may not, when running the repeater in remote mode, like when connecting ASL or a repeater controller to a YSF repeater. This problem has been reported with both DR-1X and DR-2X repeaters, but hasn't been linked to any particular software / firmware version.

I encourage you to put your repeater in remote mode and make sure that you have a valid CTCSS logic signal at the accessory connector. You can do that by placing a meter on pin 3 of the 15 pin (HD-15) accessory connector - and see if CTCSS decode logic is available. If your repeater provides the logic - you don't (necessarily) need one of the following solutions.

The SC-50DW and SC-75DW are combination boards providing both CTCSS (PL) detection, and noise squelch detection (COS). One of these two boards would be used if the repeater owner wanted CTCSS access of the repeater in addition to better noise squelch operation. All of the boards mentioned create the logic signals that are required to make external control hardware aware of a valid user. These logic signals replace the ones available at the repeater's DB15 and does so with higher quality ones.

Dual Mode Capability:
Some people want to retain the ability to use both C4FM and Analog. When you want the ability to use either Analog or Digital voice modes - some additional hardware is required. A device like an Arcom ADR or MABEL is required to keep the YSF repeater from locking up. These products also allow connection of the ASL interface to the repeater and provide functionality that isn't otherwise available. One of these these solutions may also be required if you need to encode a CTCSS tone on the repeater transmitter for the users radios to decode.

MABEL is a circuit board interface made to easily connect several components together to add ASL to a YSF repeater and retain C4FM. It provides CTCSS tone generation with a free program called "Pi Tone" that additionally runs on the Raspberry Pi that hosts AllStar Link. MABEL is designed to use the "SC" or "CT" products available from Masters Communications, and fixes the limitation of the SC-50DW and SC-75DW not having simultaneous CTCSS encode. This solution solves every problem I'm aware of with the YSF repeaters operation and provides both digital and analog FM operation including ASL.

The Arcom ADR is a similar product to MABEL. It doesn't include a better noise squelch detection system - it only does CTCSS, but it does both encode and decode simultaneously.

Each product has their own explanations as to what they do, so I won't get into that detail here. Additionally - I cannot provide detailed support of these 3rd party products, you'll need to work with them for support of their stuff.

What others have done:
Some folks have connected a RA-DR1X(M) directly to the YSF repeater with a custom interface cable. I prefer the cable made by Marshall at URI Cables. If you're fine with the RSSI squelch and your repeater does CTCSS decode and encode in remote mode, and, you don't need or want Auto Mode selection - this is the best solution. I recommend HamVoIP for YSF AllStar Link installs.

Many people prefer the SC-50DW or the SC-75DW because they provide both a quality noise squelch (detection and logic) and a quality CTCSS decoder (detection and logic) that operates independently from the repeater's internal hardware. These boards are designed to feed logic to a radio interface like MABEL, Arcom ADR, RA Series AllStarLink interfaces, or a conventional repeater controller. The SC-50 and SC-75DW can encode or decode the CTCSS tone - BUT neither can encode and decode at the same time. As such - most people use the board to decode, because it's less expensive to (then) add CTCSS encode if you need or want it. While my SC-50DW or SC-75DW cures two problems with the receive, there's no available CTCSS encoder for the repeater's transmitter. If your users don't need a tone to listen to / monitor the repeater - this limitation isn't a problem. If your repeater actually generates a tone when placed into the remote node - this limitation isn't a problem. If the repeater needs to encode a CTCSS tone for the users - an additional CTCSS encode device may be required. Thankfully - there are lots of ways to successfully and inexpensively generate a CTCSS tone, and either MABEL or the ADR should be considered.

Here is a summary of the options:

Option 1:
Directly connect a RA-DR1X (or RA-DR1XM) to the Yaesu System Fusion repeater with a cable.
Fixed FM mode only.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
Possibly no CTCSS encode, and no improved noise squelch detection.
This solution assumes your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS decoder and logic.

Option 2:
Use a RA-DR1X(M) and a CTCSS encoder.
Fixed FM mode only.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
CTCSS encode capability, but NO improved noise squelch detection.
This solution assumes your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS decoder and logic.

Option 3:
Use a RA-DR1X and a SC-50DW or SC-75DW.
Fixed FM mode only.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
Improved noise squelch and CTCSS detection, but possibly NO CTCSS encode capability.
This solution doesn't care if your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS decoder and logic.

Option 4:
Use a RA-DR1X, a SC-75DW, and a CTCSS encoder.
Fixed FM mode only.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
Improved noise squelch and CTCSS detection, and CTCSS encode capability.
This solution doesn't care if your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS encoder / decoder and logic.

Option 5:
Use an Arcom ADR and a RA-DR1X(M).
Auto Mode Operation.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
CTCSS encode and decode capability, but NO improved noise squelch detection.
This solution doesn't care if your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS encoder / decoder and logic.

Option 6:
Use MABEL, a RA-DR1X (not M) and a SC-50/75DW.
Auto Mode Operation.
Carrier and/or CTCSS access to the repeater.
CTCSS encode and decode capability, and improved noise squelch detection.
This solution doesn't care if your YSF Repeater has a working CTCSS encoder/ decoder and logic.
MABEL is designed to connect a standard RA-DR1X. The metal case of the M could make installation difficult.

Hope this helps...

Kevin

Email Kevin Custer for more informaion.